Friday, March 13, 2009

The Nuns Woulda Just Hit Me With A Ruler

Perhaps the biggest struggle anytime a group of people come together to accomplish a common goal revolves around the concept or rules or guidelines. What do you have that defines how you will work together? These things can take the form of charters, rulebooks, laws, even constitutions.

WoW raiding groups are no exception. We need rules. People need to know what's expected of them. End of story.

As our Alliance continues to grow and we push for 25-man content. The comment has come up that we really need to hammer out some rules. We've always had more of a loose coalition, but recently we've been gaining more members and more momentum as a group. Thus, the necessity for more concrete rules has sprung up.

Lately, the rule of discussion has been being late (ha ha, see what I did there? lately... late... ha). How do you deal with people being late to a raid?

Lets said the posted start time is 8PM server time. To me, that means the goal is for the first pull to start at 8PM. As leader, I will be on at least a half hour before the posted raid time in order to get myself ready, get to the instance, and start invites fifteen minutes prior to the start time. What happens when everyone isn't there at start time? What happens when someone has indicated that they may be delayed (we have a nifty little check box that one can check indicating a possible latency)? This is where the rule needs to come in.

Here is what I propose:

We will try to begin invites 15 minutes prior to the posted start time. If you are not on prior to the start time and have not indicated to anyone in raid that you may be late (be it by check box or verbally in some manner), your spot is in jeopardy and you may be replaced at the start time. If you have indicated in some manner that you may be late, you will be given a 10 minute waiting window before your spot may be filled as well. Abuse of this policy will be handled on a case by case basis with the person in question and by a consensus among the officers.

So what do you think? To harsh for a casual alliance? To lenient? Just right like baby bear's porridge? I'd love some feedback on this.


  1. I don't think it's too harsh. Sometimes I think people have a different idea about what the posted time means... some think that's when they need to log in by, some think it's time of first pull... etc.

    I'd hate to do a disservice to all, but maybe post the start time for 15 minutes prior to when you would normally be scheduled to start?

    For example, when I schedule a relaxation massage (ooh they are sooo nice), the appointment is scheduled for say.. 10am, but my appointment card says 9:45am because I'm expected to arrive early enough to check in, change and whatnot.

  2. You think? Starting it early? Doesn't that serve to de-emphasize the start time then, since it just seems to be such an arbitrary time then? Or, look at it this way. Wouldn't you rather know exactly what is going on instead of being toyed with by using mind games? I admit they can be useful, but I feel like if I do that, people will think: "they just put that early time to encourage people on early, that doesn't mean i have to be on early..." Ya know what i'm saying?

  3. I think your suggestion is just fine. Make it very clear that starting time means 1st pull, not time to start the trip to the instance or even time to start buffing.

    If you're one of those who are always in time it's extremely annoying to have to wait for latecomers, wasting precious raiding time.

    Also suggest people who know they may be late to place their toons outside the instance. I often do that anyway, just to be sure, if some RL stuff will mess things up for me.

  4. I think it sounds fine. What I do is send out invites 15 minutes prior to our start time, post a raid warning telling everyone to get reagents and repaired and head over to the stone to start summoning. We have a small issue with one raid member having to be 10-15 minutes late every other weekend but we just save her spot and clear trash and whatever bosses we can. She's aware she can miss a boss or two but that's the nature of the beast.

    Once you become "too casual", people will slowly start to take advantage of that, no show without warning, be late, not repair, etc., so you should put your foot down early rather than later, IMO.

  5. Whoa, chill. Just a suggestion. Nothing to do with devaluing the meaning of start time. O.o

    My suggestion really goes back to what I said about some people have a different idea about what the posted "start" time means.

    You say your posted time is for first pull. My old raid guild used the posted time as when invites started to go out. This still didn't mean you could be late (without reasonable notice and excuse) and expect to go.

    So, the message my other comment was meant to send: your rule is not harsh. It provides clarification. However, if people seem to struggle with being available for the invites being sent 15 mins before start, maybe post start 15 minutes earlier and see if it helps.

  6. @ Syr - lol sry. The "You think" and others were actual questions... not sarcasm. Didn't mean to come off that way. I've definitely heard people suggest exactly what you're suggesting and asked them the same thing and made the same point. What I was fishing for was exactly what you said in your second comment about how your old guild used it and it worked out (I just wanted to know if it really does work or if people just brush it off the same or w/e). If the group insists on giving everyone a 15 minute window despite if latency is indicated or not, I think you're suggestion is the best and simplest way to combat that. Rules suck. :-D

  7. In 3 years of raiding, I think that I've only once seen the 1st pull happen within 15 minutes of the start time. It just takes a while to get so many people organized.

    /shifty eyes
    Oh, and that one time, I was the last to show up...1 minute prior to the start time.

  8. I think that's perfectly reasonable. In Unemployed we have people sign up and they are expected to be online for invites at 6:30 for a first pull at 7pm sharp. If you're late, you'll be replaced.

    So far we've only started late a handful of times and often even get to first pull a little early.

  9. @Fulg - Heh. No worries. Between this cold and Dayquil, I read it like rapid fire interrogation questions. >.<

    But, I'm glad I was able to provide a more coherent example in my second comment lol